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CMTaxpayers -> East Moriches School Issues -> Westhampton Beach Tuition
Post Info TOPIC: Westhampton Beach Tuition
Hike it up

Date:
Westhampton Beach Tuition
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Incredibly, the Westhampton Beach UFSD is petitioning the Commissioner of Education to change the Seneca Falls formula so that the result is a higher regular education tuition rate for grades 7-12, increasing costs for districts like East Moriches.

 

So many people (and you know who you are) denied the significance I raised of the peculiar difference between the K-6 tuition rate and 7-12 tuition rate in WHB (see my Update in the Archives from March 27, 2007). “Crazy”, they said. “You are barking up the wrong tree”, they said. Still, I knew something was up.

 

Now we know.

 

After the state changed the special education tuition formula to a single tier from a two tier system (something that WHB admitted caught them by surprise), WHB started capturing more high school instruction costs into special education (perform a review of expenses on the WHB State Aid website comparing 2007-08 actuals to 2003-04). Why did they do this? Because the single tier system wasn’t providing the same revenue stream the two tier system was providing.

 

What was the effect? LOWER regular high school tuition, to the point that elementary tuition rates blew past high school tuition rates (something very uncommon), by $2000 per student. That would normally have been good news for sending districts like East Moriches, but as with most good things, they come to an end. In this case, the entity trying to end it is WHB, at the expense of East Moriches.

 

In yesterday’s Southampton Press there was an article describing how WHB, having adopted a budget proposal that could lead to a 7.67% increase in property taxes, thinks that is too much to place on the local community, so instead they will petition the SED Commissioner to change the formula again so that the new “maximum allowable tuition rate” (remember that phrase?) increases, costing districts like East Moriches more money.

 

Three years ago I predicted WHB tuition would be over $20,000 per student this year. I was wrong, but now we know why, and we also know WHB agrees with me.

TopStroke.jpg

Thursday, March 26, 2009

WHB Wants Higher Tuition

(written by BOE member Glenn Neuschwender)

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Anonymous

Date:
RE: Westhampton Beach Tuition
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what a kick in the pants.   you could have saved money by merging with center moriches.  now you  get what is coming to you.  HIGHER TUITION PAYMENTS.biggrin

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WHBer

Date:
RE: Westhampton Beach Tuition
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Anonymous

Date:
RE: Westhampton Beach Tuition
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Anonymous wrote:

what a kick in the pants.   you could have saved money by merging with center moriches.  now you  get what is coming to you.  HIGHER TUITION PAYMENTS.biggrin


What facts do you have to show that merging would have saved EM or CM any money?  Everything I read indicated that neither district would be no better off financially following a merge...

And for all those with visions of utopia, ask our neighbors in ESM if their taxes are lower and/or if their district is good financial standing.

 



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Anonymous

Date:
RE: Westhampton Beach Tuition
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Anonymous, I don't know if a merger would have resulted in financial savings for either or both of our districts, but I know it would have resulted in the potential for improved opportunities for ALL of our kids. I can tell you that ESM is a very well thought of district and is percieved to have a lot ot offer. I can also tell you that when WHB kicked South Manor to the curb it had no negative effect on property values or any other aspect of the community.

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Anonymous

Date:
RE: Westhampton Beach Tuition
Permalink   

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous, I don't know if a merger would have resulted in financial savings for either or both of our districts, but I know it would have resulted in the potential for improved opportunities for ALL of our kids. I can tell you that ESM is a very well thought of district and is percieved to have a lot ot offer. I can also tell you that when WHB kicked South Manor to the curb it had no negative effect on property values or any other aspect of the community.


1.  I agree with you that ESM is a great school with a robust program...I only brought them up because it does not seem that incentive money has left them in any better financial shape than the rest of the districts on LI. 

2.  The merger is supposed to provide better edecutaional opportunity at a better cost.  The consultants pointed out that if you cannot achieve both then a merger is not a good idea.  So why are we so eager to merge if it is not going to be a better financial state?  Both districts can build more programs now if they want to increase costs, we don't need to make a new district to have more programs at an increased cost.

3.  There are many ways that districts in this County can work together to build innovative cost sharing and educational programs, but sadly this collective inquiry into the viability of a merger between two districts has created such a rift that those who wanted to merge and those who didn't are now divided like the Civil War North and South.  Most of us are in the middle, looking for ways to provide excellent educational opportunities for our children...and not unlike any other issue we face in society, there is more than one way to do that.

4. This is the most important point:  As long as the pro-merger people continue to qualify their arguments with disparaging remarks about WHB, and those opposed to merger continue to qualify their arguments with disparaging remarks about CM, we will never be able to make any progress as neighbors.

The comments I quoted in here are case-in-point:  You praise ESM's program, I agree.  You say we won't save money but would have better programs anyway, I disagree.   That is a meaningful discussion...then you havt to add a WHB slam in the end...so we no longer discuss anything because I see that you think we must merge and WHB is the cause of all trouble.  Pettiness.

 



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Anonymous

Date:
RE: Westhampton Beach Tuition
Permalink   

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous, I don't know if a merger would have resulted in financial savings for either or both of our districts, but I know it would have resulted in the potential for improved opportunities for ALL of our kids. I can tell you that ESM is a very well thought of district and is percieved to have a lot ot offer. I can also tell you that when WHB kicked South Manor to the curb it had no negative effect on property values or any other aspect of the community.


1.  I agree with you that ESM is a great school with a robust program...I only brought them up because it does not seem that incentive money has left them in any better financial shape than the rest of the districts on LI. 

2.  The merger is supposed to provide better edecutaional opportunity at a better cost.  The consultants pointed out that if you cannot achieve both then a merger is not a good idea.  So why are we so eager to merge if it is not going to be a better financial state?  Both districts can build more programs now if they want to increase costs, we don't need to make a new district to have more programs at an increased cost.

3.  There are many ways that districts in this County can work together to build innovative cost sharing and educational programs, but sadly this collective inquiry into the viability of a merger between two districts has created such a rift that those who wanted to merge and those who didn't are now divided like the Civil War North and South.  Most of us are in the middle, looking for ways to provide excellent educational opportunities for our children...and not unlike any other issue we face in society, there is more than one way to do that.

4. This is the most important point:  As long as the pro-merger people continue to qualify their arguments with disparaging remarks about WHB, and those opposed to merger continue to qualify their arguments with disparaging remarks about CM, we will never be able to make any progress as neighbors.

The comments I quoted in here are case-in-point:  You praise ESM's program, I agree.  You say we won't save money but would have better programs anyway, I disagree.   That is a meaningful discussion...then you havt to add a WHB slam in the end...so we no longer discuss anything because I see that you think we must merge and WHB is the cause of all trouble.  Pettiness.

 


I think that there is more to be discussed here than financial matters. While the incentive aid may not have left ESM better off financially than other comparable districts, I think you will agree that ALL of the students in that district have better opportunities and more options than were available before the merger. The objective of better educational opportunuty is being realized at a cost that is in line with similar districts... that is a net plus.

As far as your comment about the merger discussion being stymied by the us/them mentality between our communities, you have to look no further than the EM Board of ED for blame. The majority have refused to have any real discussion of anything that could change their relationship with WHB. CM has made overtures again and again only to be insulted and ignored by the majority on the EM BOE. CM has tried to be proactive. Have you noticed that the real estate market in EM is in the toilet? People are catching on.


 



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Anonymous

Date:
RE: Westhampton Beach Tuition
Permalink   

Anonymous wrote:

 

Anonymous wrote:

 

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous, I don't know if a merger would have resulted in financial savings for either or both of our districts, but I know it would have resulted in the potential for improved opportunities for ALL of our kids. I can tell you that ESM is a very well thought of district and is percieved to have a lot ot offer. I can also tell you that when WHB kicked South Manor to the curb it had no negative effect on property values or any other aspect of the community.


1.  I agree with you that ESM is a great school with a robust program...I only brought them up because it does not seem that incentive money has left them in any better financial shape than the rest of the districts on LI. 

2.  The merger is supposed to provide better edecutaional opportunity at a better cost.  The consultants pointed out that if you cannot achieve both then a merger is not a good idea.  So why are we so eager to merge if it is not going to be a better financial state?  Both districts can build more programs now if they want to increase costs, we don't need to make a new district to have more programs at an increased cost.

3.  There are many ways that districts in this County can work together to build innovative cost sharing and educational programs, but sadly this collective inquiry into the viability of a merger between two districts has created such a rift that those who wanted to merge and those who didn't are now divided like the Civil War North and South.  Most of us are in the middle, looking for ways to provide excellent educational opportunities for our children...and not unlike any other issue we face in society, there is more than one way to do that.

4. This is the most important point:  As long as the pro-merger people continue to qualify their arguments with disparaging remarks about WHB, and those opposed to merger continue to qualify their arguments with disparaging remarks about CM, we will never be able to make any progress as neighbors.

The comments I quoted in here are case-in-point:  You praise ESM's program, I agree.  You say we won't save money but would have better programs anyway, I disagree.   That is a meaningful discussion...then you havt to add a WHB slam in the end...so we no longer discuss anything because I see that you think we must merge and WHB is the cause of all trouble.  Pettiness.

 


I think that there is more to be discussed here than financial matters. While the incentive aid may not have left ESM better off financially than other comparable districts, I think you will agree that ALL of the students in that district have better opportunities and more options than were available before the merger. The objective of better educational opportunuty is being realized at a cost that is in line with similar districts... that is a net plus.

As far as your comment about the merger discussion being stymied by the us/them mentality between our communities, you have to look no further than the EM Board of ED for blame. The majority have refused to have any real discussion of anything that could change their relationship with WHB. CM has made overtures again and again only to be insulted and ignored by the majority on the EM BOE. CM has tried to be proactive. Have you noticed that the real estate market in EM is in the toilet? People are catching on.


 

 


Once again, it goes back to finger pointing, blaming the EMO BOE and some reference to WHB.  We never seem to be able to discuss this topic on a higher level....

I agree that there is more to be discussed than finances.  However, I feel the merger idea surfaced solely as a potential fix to financial issues.  Read the study and see how much detail goes into financial projections as opposed to any real details as to what the new District would offer academically.

As an East Moriches resident I am very satisfied with our K-8 program and the opportunity for students to select one of three High Schools, each offering certain unique advantages.  In my opinion, we have a very solid primary program and access to 3 great High School opportunites.  I have not seen any evidence indicating that the merger would be a better opportunity for ALL our students. 


 



__________________
Anonymous

Date:
RE: Westhampton Beach Tuition
Permalink   

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

 

Anonymous wrote:

Patronize : to adopt an air of superiority and condescension toward:  treat haughtily or superciliously.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous, I don't know if a merger would have resulted in financial savings for either or both of our districts, but I know it would have resulted in the potential for improved opportunities for ALL of our kids. I can tell you that ESM is a very well thought of district and is percieved to have a lot ot offer. I can also tell you that when WHB kicked South Manor to the curb it had no negative effect on property values or any other aspect of the community.


1.  I agree with you that ESM is a great school with a robust program...I only brought them up because it does not seem that incentive money has left them in any better financial shape than the rest of the districts on LI. 

2.  The merger is supposed to provide better edecutaional opportunity at a better cost.  The consultants pointed out that if you cannot achieve both then a merger is not a good idea.  So why are we so eager to merge if it is not going to be a better financial state?  Both districts can build more programs now if they want to increase costs, we don't need to make a new district to have more programs at an increased cost.

3.  There are many ways that districts in this County can work together to build innovative cost sharing and educational programs, but sadly this collective inquiry into the viability of a merger between two districts has created such a rift that those who wanted to merge and those who didn't are now divided like the Civil War North and South.  Most of us are in the middle, looking for ways to provide excellent educational opportunities for our children...and not unlike any other issue we face in society, there is more than one way to do that.

4. This is the most important point:  As long as the pro-merger people continue to qualify their arguments with disparaging remarks about WHB, and those opposed to merger continue to qualify their arguments with disparaging remarks about CM, we will never be able to make any progress as neighbors.

The comments I quoted in here are case-in-point:  You praise ESM's program, I agree.  You say we won't save money but would have better programs anyway, I disagree.   That is a meaningful discussion...then you havt to add a WHB slam in the end...so we no longer discuss anything because I see that you think we must merge and WHB is the cause of all trouble.  Pettiness.

 


I think that there is more to be discussed here than financial matters. While the incentive aid may not have left ESM better off financially than other comparable districts, I think you will agree that ALL of the students in that district have better opportunities and more options than were available before the merger. The objective of better educational opportunuty is being realized at a cost that is in line with similar districts... that is a net plus.

As far as your comment about the merger discussion being stymied by the us/them mentality between our communities, you have to look no further than the EM Board of ED for blame. The majority have refused to have any real discussion of anything that could change their relationship with WHB. CM has made overtures again and again only to be insulted and ignored by the majority on the EM BOE. CM has tried to be proactive. Have you noticed that the real estate market in EM is in the toilet? People are catching on.


 

 


Once again, it goes back to finger pointing, blaming the EMO BOE and some reference to WHB.  We never seem to be able to discuss this topic on a higher level....

I agree that there is more to be discussed than finances.  However, I feel the merger idea surfaced solely as a potential fix to financial issues.  Read the study and see how much detail goes into financial projections as opposed to any real details as to what the new District would offer academically.

As an East Moriches resident I am very satisfied with our K-8 program and the opportunity for students to select one of three High Schools, each offering certain unique advantages.  In my opinion, we have a very solid primary program and access to 3 great High School opportunites.  I have not seen any evidence indicating that the merger would be a better opportunity for ALL our students. 


 


Patronize : to adopt an air of superiority and condescension toward:  treat haughtily or superciliously.


thank you for the answer that I expected.......you are exibit A of what is wrong in EMO..........Bye

 



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Anonymous

Date:
RE: Westhampton Beach Tuition
Permalink   

I am sorry that my satisfaction with my school is a problem, and I am not sure what is patronizing about my comments.

Why is it that you can be proud of your program,  ESM is allowed to be proud of theirs, but it is condescending of me to simply state that I am also happy with what I have?    How I feel about my District is based upon my District and is not a judgement on anyone else.  Where is the air of superiority in that? 

I have to assume you are as proud of Center Moriches Schools as I am of East Morihces Schools.  I also assume you are looking for ways to strive for continued improvement, as am I.  We simply have a difference of opinion as to how we achieve that goal. 

You feel a merged district would present an opportunity; I do not. 
You think the new Distrcit will be better than the two that currently exist; I believe that these two Distrcits each have a better future in their current structure. 

So we disagree...that's all.







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Interupter

Date:
RE: Westhampton Beach Tuition
Permalink   

What is patronizing is your "comment" of bringing this argument to a "higher level" !   EM seems to think they are of some higher status!  hahahahaha

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Move to WHB

Date:
RE: Westhampton Beach Tuition
Permalink   

Anonymous wrote:



 

Anonymous wrote:



what a kick in the pants.   you could have saved money by merging with center moriches.  now you  get what is coming to you.  HIGHER TUITION PAYMENTS.biggrin




What facts do you have to show that merging would have saved EM or CM any money?  Everything I read indicated that neither district would be no better off financially following a merge...

And for all those with visions of utopia, ask our neighbors in ESM if their taxes are lower and/or if their district is good financial standing.

 

 




   East Moriches would save money on the difference in tuition   $13,000(the discounted rate CM gave them)  and $19,000 WHB is charging .....  and theres the 17 MILLION DOLLARS that you EM naysayers believed wouldn't make this a great district ....when honestly CM  IS A GREAT DISTRICT !
GO MOVE TO WHB !

 



__________________
Anonymous

Date:
RE: Westhampton Beach Tuition
Permalink   

Interupter wrote:

What is patronizing is your "comment" of bringing this argument to a "higher level" !   EM seems to think they are of some higher status!  hahahahaha


Thank You, You hit ther nail on the head!

 



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EM Taxpayer

Date:
RE: Westhampton Beach Tuition
Permalink   



Tuition savings between westhamprton beach and center moriches is less than stated.  The discount rate used in the study was for one year only and expired. 

The savings comes with a cost.
The cost to add program to center moriches/merged district to match what is offered at  esm or wb is unknown.
 
The incentive aid of $1.2 million a year for 14 years sounds good.

The incentive aid comes with a cost..
The cost expand the high school to accept em students is in the tens of millions.
The cost to expand the high school to accept the em ms students is in the tens of millions too.
Construction cost changes or overruns?
Increased utility costs?
   
It doesn't appear to be a financial benefit to the east moriches taxpayer.


   

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Anonymous

Date:
RE: Westhampton Beach Tuition
Permalink   

EM Taxpayer wrote:





Tuition savings between westhamprton beach and center moriches is less than stated.  The discount rate used in the study was for one year only and expired. 

The savings comes with a cost.
The cost to add program to center moriches/merged district to match what is offered at  esm or wb is unknown.
 
The incentive aid of $1.2 million a year for 14 years sounds good.

The incentive aid comes with a cost..
The cost expand the high school to accept em students is in the tens of millions.
The cost to expand the high school to accept the em ms students is in the tens of millions too.
Construction cost changes or overruns?
Increased utility costs?
   
It doesn't appear to be a financial benefit to the east moriches taxpayer.


   




Just keep drinking that kool-aide my friend...........

 



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Committee member

Date:
RE: Westhampton Beach Tuition
Permalink   



Unbelievable what these people believe!

__________________
Anonymous

Date:
RE: Westhampton Beach Tuition
Permalink   

EM Taxpayer wrote:



Tuition savings between westhamprton beach and center moriches is less than stated.  The discount rate used in the study was for one year only and expired. 

The savings comes with a cost.
The cost to add program to center moriches/merged district to match what is offered at  esm or wb is unknown.
 
The incentive aid of $1.2 million a year for 14 years sounds good.

The incentive aid comes with a cost..
The cost expand the high school to accept em students is in the tens of millions.
The cost to expand the high school to accept the em ms students is in the tens of millions too.
Construction cost changes or overruns?
Increased utility costs?
   
It doesn't appear to be a financial benefit to the east moriches taxpayer.


   


Great Job EM on the test scores in math, english and keeping the low tax rate.

  

__________________
dream on EMO

Date:
RE: Westhampton Beach Tuition
Permalink   



Someone needs all the minutes of the committee meetings.  EM NEVER had any intention of merging....  end of story

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